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US honour for 98-year-old woman whose Mayo weather report changed D-Day landing
Pretty cool. I've been on a big WWII kick lately and I knew they delayed for 24 hours because of weather but I never knew her story.
Its interesting that this is happening now because the literature in the last decade has moved to a point where it’s agreed by modern historians the weather report was wrong and the weather on the 5th was better than the 6th and it should have went ahead on time. The extra day of good weather may have allowed them to capture Caen in the first week. (Athlo personally I find that unlikely due to the tactics the Germans employed)
This now makes me wonder if the weather was the reason that my grandfather’s battalion was dropped in the wrong place. They dropped between midnight and 1am on the 6th. Almost half of their Dakotas dropped them in the Bois de Bavent instead of their actual drop zone.
Most of the pilots were flying slow planes and were not used to flying so slow and low under fire. They tried to avoid anti-aircraft fire from the Germans, then climbed too high and flew too fast for the airborne. They also hit the green light early to get the troopers out. There was a lot of confusion. The clouds didn’t help but it was not the only factor. There was also pathfinders that were shot down. Just the confusion of war with inexperience all round.
The series band of brothers gives a pretty accurate depiction of what happend with the airborne. And it's too easy to forget that the pilots flying those boys in at night under fire were also basically teenagers. So yeah I can't blame them for being scared shitless and drifting off course.
Such a good series.
My grandad was in the British Army. But yes, he turned 20 about a month before this. I’m much older than that myself now, and I can’t even comprehend what it must have been like for them all. I can’t imagine throwing myself out of a plane at all, let alone doing it regularly with people and planes shooting at me as I went!
the western offensive was really just a reprieve for the russians. it was an inevitable victory for the allies, especially with the US' nuclear program. napolean and hitler both lost because britain ruled the seas and the russians had more bodies than they had bullets.
The Russians were very well equipped once they fully mobilized and were able to stop retreating as often. Arguably better equipped than the Nazis
Better equipped than the nazis late in the war isn’t that big of an achievement to be honest; they really deteriorated by then.
And why did they deteriorate… it wasn’t because of human wave tactics, it’s because they went out and beat them strategically and tactically, with even or superior equipment.
I never said human wave tactics. The soviets were decently equipped by the end of the war, and they certainly had better leadership as well. There were many reasons they won, but i just wanted to say that the best equipped Wehrmacht troops early in the way were likely better equipped than the soviets late in the war.
In what way do you mean better equipped? The average Wehrmacht soldier for the whole war was armed with the K98k, but the later-war Soviets fielded whole units armed with semiautomatic rifles or submachineguns.
Better equipped, with worse tanks, guns, and no winter clothes?
I think there's a strong argument that Lend Lease to the Soviets was far more significant than D-Day in achieving victory.
In the sense that it helped keep the Soviet front alive until they stabilized, at least, opening the path for two fronts. Three or four, really. People always forget the Allies invaded Italy and fought in Africa first.
So are you saying they're honoring the weatherperson despite an incorrect weather report that delayed the landing?
I also just learned this and literally only from watching Band of Brothers, lolz
Just wait until you learn about operation mincemeat
Adding Mayo to the title was confusing. But I guess that's why we need to read the actual article.
Is mayonnaise a weather instrument?
Mayo is a county in Ireland. On the coast.
Is horseradish a weather instrument?
Is Patrick a weather instrument?
No, Patrick is a mayonnaise.
If you leave a jar of mayonnaise outside and it is especially runny, it is probably raining, if it is solid, the temperature is below freezing, if it disappears then winds are probably high, etc.
And people spend money on a atmospheric science degree! Those fools! What if I only use the miracle whip system?
Then you’ll have to convert to the Mayo system for the rest of the world to understand it.
Is Mayo a type of weather? That would be rough. "it's mayonnaising outside and I'm wearing suede, I hope I can find my umbrella"
Just go out with some bread and deli meat!
Mayo County, Ireland is the name of the locality where she recorded the weather. There. Now we don't.
Oh thank god
bless you for saving my dignity as a redditor
I'm from Northern Ireland and even I didn't know this. We prefice all our counties with "Co." 😅
also that's where mayo was invented, TIL! strangely enough also the birthplace of Ismael Zambada, incredible
Mayo is a lovely county, by the way, in case anyone was thinking of going to somewhere in Ireland that's a bit different than the usual places. My family on my dad's side all originate from Lettermaghera. Really beautiful place.
I thought they were just using a slur for whites lol
Tomorrow's Headlines: "Irish Times Throws Shade at Old White Lady for No Reason"
I prefer cracker
Crackers and Mayo. Delicious.
I don’t think there *is* an actual slur for whites
I love learning about ordinary people who did ordinary things that turned out to be extraordinary... brilliant.
That's my life summed up. Except for the extraordinary part.
So far. You still have time! :)
The vast majority of us will be average at best based on what society sees as “extraordinary”. I think we hold ourselves to way too high of a standard. You can be extraordinary to one person and change their life in an incredible way. I’m sure you have already been extraordinary to someone - whether it be a friend, child, spouse, or someone else. So don’t sell yourself short.
Recently watch a mini Doc about the weather. June 5th was the day of the invasion and the commanders were all hell bent on. The weather had been clear the following week and advisors were stressing there would not be a storm. This mini report caused quite the debate and in the end Dwight chose to postpone against the advice of his fellow commanders and advisors. This women saved thousands of lives and very possibly the invasions success. It’s also commonly known Hitler was asleep June 6th and had he been awake which he was on June 5th the tank commanders would have advanced towards the beaches and delayed if not pushed back the allies off the beach head. Not even factoring in the storm which most certainly would have hindered the invasion.
> It’s also commonly known Hitler was asleep June 6th and had he been awake which he was on June 5th... It is commonly known that he was asleep. It is not commonly known that one of numerous possibilities would have happened had that not been the case, particularly when that possibility doesn't mesh with anything that had been happening all along. Hitler was in Berchtesgaden on the 5th (and 6th) attending a wedding party for Eva Braun's sister. He was not in a position to make quick decisions either day. The few hours of delay in informing him due to his being asleep would have been of little utility for him given his extreme paranoia that everything that happened away from Calais was a feint. The notion that had Hitler just been awake, the Wehrmacht would have crushed the invasion comes directly from German commanders after the war, ironically employed by Allied occupation forces, working on the "If only Hitler had listened to his generals ..." myth. >the tank commanders would have advanced towards the beaches and delayed if not pushed back the allies off the beach head. Not even factoring in the storm which most certainly would have hindered the invasion. Hitler was not convinced the Normandy invasion was the actual invasion until the end of **July**, this being the reason he did not release the 15th Army until then. This army, and its armored formations, are what is being referred to as potentially decisive in attempts to repel the full invasion. As it was, 7th Army had to do it by itself and simply couldn't with what they had available. What armor was actually available at the time was mostly pointed at the British who would have had their beachhead well before any of the armor could come up. What would most likely have changed was the plan to take Caen, which in turn would have influenced the American thrust toward St. Lo, but how that plays out is unknowable. There were many points at which had the Germany military acted differently, their chances of a more successful defense were higher. They acted on very few of them and none of them with the force necessary, in large part because they simply did not believe Normandy was the main Allied effort. Hitler wouldn't have believed it on the 5th any more than he did on the 6th. See: Weinberg, Gerhard. *A World at Arms: A Global History of World War II*, all of Chapter 12, for more details.
Someone up top said that historians declared the weather report to be inaccurate and the 5th had actually better weather than the 6th can you kindly go up and debate I need this resolved
maybe try /r/askhistorians?
Collective effort, and yet so many individual stories about heroes 💙
Better late than never, I guess.
Me and the wife just finished The Imitation Game today about the Codebreakers of the Enigma. Fantastic movie if you've not seen it yet.
Fine movie, but it's one of the least accurate "based on true events" movies of all time, which is a high (or low?) bar. Alan Turing existed, he had a tremendous impact on the project, and he was gay. That's about the extent of what they got right. He didn't invent the Bombe, he didn't have to fight against skeptical generals, he was well liked and sociable and not the aloof autistic type they portrayed him as, he wasn't in charge of the overall project nor the only leader, he never met the spy at Bletchley Park and certainty wasn't blackmailed into being a traitor. The cryptographers weren't making decisions about what information to provide to military leadership and the computer he envisioned wasn't named Christopher. And he knew that Christopher was sick, his death wasn't out of the blue.
> The cryptographers weren't making decisions about what information to provide to military leadership Having been in the military, that part struck me the most as WTF. Intelligence folk keeping back information from leadership in order to run the war themselves could be considered treason. Also very much need to have separation between those who collect the data and those who analyze it... otherwise you get some terrible biases and mistakes.
Was it a ham radio report on Mayo?
How does the milk not spoil? Here in the US, in grocery stores, it is considered spoiled if it's been out of refrigeration for more than 30 minutes.
This must be a joke anyway but mayonnaise isn’t made with milk, it’s the eggs that make it spoil.
Well all it takes is to live to 98 to get recognition
Of course, there's no information on the 98 year old guy whose weather report was called mustard. ;-D VINCENT I dunno, I didn't go into a Burger King. But you know what they put on french fries in Holland instead of ketchup? JULES What? VINCENT Mayonnaise. JULES Goddamn! VINCENT I seen 'em do it. And I don't mean a little bit on the side of the plate, they fuckin' drown 'em in it.
Actually true. It's called patatje met (Fries with) (note the absence of the mayo, since every Dutch person you knows that you mean with mayo. Also, it's not a small amount, you put it on top of the fries like you are trying to cover the lasagna with grated cheese. That's why the small forks exist. Truth in movies and memes, it surprises you sometimes.
So she did reading. Just like millions other people, each performed their duties as they were trained to do. We won the war because of them, each one of of them.
Not exactly trained to be part of the military though. Their weather reports being used by the military was kept secret from them.
Her country wasn’t even in the war.
And we still got bombed because some German dickhead wanted to lighten his load on the way home. A lot of Irish people went to the UK to volunteer.
Both civilian and military duties. Both are important.
If anything, the Soviet Union won ETO.
also why they deemed it acceptable to indiscriminately entire villages or towns, because it was a total war and most people were military targets
Bombs weren't exactly accurate in the 1940s. What would you have proposed as an alternative?
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